Riots in Little India

[specuvestor]

It is not an isolated case when something of such severity happens. Only the paranoid survives. This is a low probability high consequence event.

There are many issues at hand here:

Firstly as per my my post in another thread, there is a cultural issue.
http://www.valuebuddies.com/thread-4212-...l#pid68620
Indeed OPMI is right that they think they are still in India. Similarly the Chinese think they are in China. There is a HUGE cultural divide between how Singaporeans do things and them. And they problem is that slowly but surely our culture is actually being eroded.

2ndly it is a result of rich/wealth policy. Here we see a manifestation of low level labor angry at the affluence of Singapore. Flip it over and we can also see how Singaporeans are angry with the uber rich. Instead of being the switzerland of the east by 2020, we are becoming the UAE by 2020. OTOH while this event looks impactful VISUALLY, white collar crimes, hot money, rich man's excesses would have even more devastating impact on the economy and populace as a whole if not managed properly.

3rdly the fanatical focus on the PnL of Singapore Inc has these side effects as warned many times. This is FORESEEABLE. So does the 2 casinos. Instead of using foreign labour to suppress low end labor price and cap CPI, end of day it might just be the Austalian model of increasing the price of these labour that no one wants to do, may be more effective int the long run. The irony of course is that CPI was not curbed because asset inflation killed it anyway.

I seriously hope the govt realises that these are social costs that are much too high for us to pay. The people are not always right, but in this case the people's discontent with excessive foreigners is correct.

No worries , our Gov. said they could integrate them into our society , I always have tremendous confidence in what they said . There are so many scholars and creams of the creams running this country, you see after more than 12 hours , the riot is under controlled now with some help from Gurkha, although some police cars were overturned or burned, the losses were insignificant . Believe even without the help of the Gurkha , our police is capable of controlling the situation also. Cheers .

I think Singaporeans take these major incidences too lightly. This is not a matter of drunkenness at 9pm or belittling "arresting people for under age sex and issue summons". Like OPMI mention about the Broken Windows theory... if we don't nip the problem at the bud, it will snowball to something greater when perceptions start to irreversibly change.

Observe around you and you will see that perception does shape reality, whether it is a fact becomes secondary.

The trickier issue is the govt have to re-examine their assumption and policies. Not easy for elites to say they are wrong.

[Behappyalways]

I am in tan tock seng hospital with my mum for medical check up. Saw 2 indians accompanied by police for check up.1 in eye clinic. Ha ha wonder if they pay. Sigh tax payer money

[corydorus]

This are foreign laborers from lower or no education background. We need them to lower our cost of living and to do jobs most of our generations won't. They are not FT !! Please do not confuse on what we need and what not.

This laborers just have to be managed. They are paid or given jobs that their home country can't else they would not have come here.
Sure there is cost attached and random situations but overall is still much cheaper and helps improve ours.

[countonme]

There are many knock-on effects from the pro-wealthy policies. Like importing of FTs which take away jobs from PMET. Low tax which translate to increase in wealthy spending power thus high coes, high housing prices, inflation. Also import of cheap labours to lower labour cost, and perhaps at this category many are unhappy thus...

Base on reports so far, and the response from Bangladesh High Comm, the riot likely involved mainly from Bangladesh workers here. It is nothing to do a rich/wealth policies or even FT policies. It is more on the reliance on foreign labour in Singapore property sector, including meeting the HDB demands.

The change of policy to reduce the reliance is a proactive measure to avoid similar riot in Singapore, IMO

[specuvestor]

Foreigners are entitled to their human rights, of seeking treatment, of non-exploitations, of dignity. My issue is that management of the influx is not done properly with obsessive focus on just simple mathematical PnL. Big picture is often more complicated than just numbers.

This writer sums up quite aptly the issues, though they are more complex in reality:
http://sg.news.yahoo.com/blogs/singapore...37580.html

[Behappyalways]

If you employ a worker and one day he suddenly smashed up your machinery and during the process he hurts his fingers. Should you pay for his medical fees?

[countonme]

Perhaps they shld use some warning methods like firing in air or using water gun. Wat if there are people in the over-turned cars? And for those people staying around that area, if the riot breaks into a fire and burn the houses and taking lives.

I remember from over 20 years ago during ns when doing guard duty we always kena activated for stand-to or riot drills. One of the drills call for using loud hailer to try to disperse crowd failing which load magazine and fire warning shot in the air.

Those police cars no loud hailer? Police no carry guns or attended riot drill training?

[specuvestor]

If you employ a worker and one day he suddenly smashed up your machinery and during the process he hurts his fingers. Should you pay for his medical fees?

If he is covered by insurance or company policy yes. Even a death sentence inmate is entitled to medical treatment

He will be prosecuted for his actions nonetheless. We have to be clear minded that issue of human rights (for example marginalisation) and illegal actions are separate and should remain separate.

Similarly an elected govt cannot choose to disadvantage an opposition ward for a national policy. There are basic universal rights that should not be trampled by fear or angst

There are fine but yet distinct lines not to co-mingle issues.

[yeokiwi]

Congregations of workers from subcontinental at Little India is the choice of Singaporeans.(anywhere except my place)
Looking down on blue collar jobs is also the choice of Singaporeans.
Cheap food, cheap maid, more condos, more flats are also the choice of Singaporeans.
Retire before 40 is also the choice of Singaporeans (hey.. how many retired before 40 threads do we have in this forum??)
If you retire before 40, besides replacing you, we also need more FWs to serve you.

It is nice to push all blames to the policy makers but we have to look at the mirror ourself.
Policy makers made those policies because that is what the majority wants.

To begin, with a salary that leads a nominal life, is it ok for your kids to be cleaners/construction workers/garbage collectors?

and please, do your houseworks yourself.

It's very easy to say majority want this and look down on blue collar jobs. Consider that government has raised living standards, home prices have gone up but pay has not changed very much. who can survive on low income?

Yes. It is easy to say because that is the current situation. There is a cost to everything.
The government can be changed but can your mentality change?
No maid?
Return your own tray?
Rent seeking mindset?
Passive investor career?
Wait longer for flat?

So what if you can change the government but the hoard mentality remains the same?

[weijian]

Perhaps they shld use some warning methods like firing in air or using water gun. Wat if there are people in the over-turned cars? And for those people staying around that area, if the riot breaks into a fire and burn the houses and taking lives.

I remember from over 20 years ago during ns when doing guard duty we always kena activated for stand-to or riot drills. One of the drills call for using loud hailer to try to disperse crowd failing which load magazine and fire warning shot in the air.

Those police cars no loud hailer? Police no carry guns or attended riot drill training?

IMHO, i think the police did alright on hindsight. There were ~10+ injured police/SCDF personnel and if guns/loud hailers were used BEFORE backup arrived, it may jollywell have being 10+ fatalities.

While pending more details to uncover what exactly happen, i would commend the SCDF on their restraint and hence zero fatalities from the rioter's side. Finally, i believe many lessons could be learnt in terms of future response time or on how such incidents could be prevented (eg. with greater security at such congregations or organise more cricket games for them to channel their energy positively? )