BBR Holdings

[desmondxyz]

BBR posting losses for Q2, while OKP's profit doubles. General construction more competitive than expressway construction?

http://infopub.sgx.com/FileOpen/Profit%2...eID=465106

BBR has quite poor execution in other projects....

[TTTI]

BBR posting losses for Q2, while OKP's profit doubles. General construction more competitive than expressway construction?

http://infopub.sgx.com/FileOpen/Profit%2...eID=465106

BBR has quite poor execution in other projects....

Well, some deep pocketed guy or guys disagree apparently
Share price has been going ballistic

[karlmarx]

Indeed it has. Whether these purchases make sense or not, only time can tell. Perhaps they are privy to certain information?

Personally, I firmly believe in investing based only on a company's merits, and not what the market participants are doing. While many opportunities may be lost this way, I find it easier to sleep at night; which makes for a more sustainable practice.

[sgmystique]

Indeed it has. Whether these purchases make sense or not, only time can tell. Perhaps they are privy to certain information?

Personally, I firmly believe in investing based only on a company's merits, and not what the market participants are doing. While many opportunities may be lost this way, I find it easier to sleep at night; which makes for a more sustainable practice.

In this case it seems very obvious that somebody seems to know what is happening behind the scenes and is buying in anticipation. 

Very difficult for the layman to have conviction in such a story till the story is out!!!

[ksir]

Indeed it has. Whether these purchases make sense or not, only time can tell. Perhaps they are privy to certain information?

Personally, I firmly believe in investing based only on a company's merits, and not what the market participants are doing. While many opportunities may be lost this way, I find it easier to sleep at night; which makes for a more sustainable practice.

In this case it seems very obvious that somebody seems to know what is happening behind the scenes and is buying in anticipation. 

Very difficult for the layman to have conviction in such a story till the story is out!!!

It could be or if the buyers are exactly the ones trying to implement change by control!!?

BBR is always undervalued in numbers but trapped in quality of the management (probably due to different incentive of management and the parent co).

So in order to realise the value, a quick way is to change the management quality.
How to change management? Acquired stakes big enough to control the company?!

[TTTI]

Indeed it has. Whether these purchases make sense or not, only time can tell. Perhaps they are privy to certain information?

Personally, I firmly believe in investing based only on a company's merits, and not what the market participants are doing. While many opportunities may be lost this way, I find it easier to sleep at night; which makes for a more sustainable practice.

In this case it seems very obvious that somebody seems to know what is happening behind the scenes and is buying in anticipation. 

Very difficult for the layman to have conviction in such a story till the story is out!!!

It could be or if the buyers are exactly the ones trying to implement change by control!!?

BBR is always undervalued in numbers but trapped in quality of the management (probably due to different incentive of management and the parent co).

So in order to realise the value, a quick way is to change the management quality.
How to change management? Acquired stakes big enough to control the company?!

errr what do you mean by "probably due to different incentive of management and the parent co"?
BBR has no parent company to talk about.
Their largest shareholder is a holding company that's controlled by various members of their current management team and directors. It's not the parent company, it's just a holding company, no different from if you and I incorporate a company to hold shares.

And in reply to the earlier comments...
Yep, the layman wouldn't know or have conviction.
And that's the gist of the whole game isn't it?

The layman needs to "invest based only on a company's merits" in order to "sleep well at night."
The problem is, when a company's merits are apparent, guess what, the share price reflects it. Unless it is only apparent to you only, and nobody else sees it or believes in it. In which case, you wouldn't be "the layman"

If the share price reflects the company's apparent merits, then the best you can hope for as a shareholder, is to participate in the future growth of the company (that's not been realized yet, and is not factored into the share price, and in which case, you wouldn't anticipate it either, but can only hope for it)
So at any 1 point, you're paying what is deemed as fair value based on the "apparent merits" that presumably everyone knows about already, and hoping that future news are favorable and participating in that growth.

And if that's your sole modus operandi, i.e. your investment is based on participation in just future growth, and paying a fair value for the current "apparent merits", (vs taking up positions when there is a gap between the price and what you personally deem to be the intrinsic value) then I'd think there's a strong case for just indexing and passive investing, instead of active.


If one is actively investing, surely the ultimate goal is to beat a passive instrument, usually some broad based index. If not that, then what else?

And if the goal is to beat a passive instrument, then you surely have to rely on something to find things that are not apparent merits yet. (superior due diligence? More intense effort? Better judgement? More accurate interpretation of widely available data? Competitive advantage by having experience in the industry? <Gasp> insider information? whatever) and take up positions which are unpopular and/or neglected, and hope that in time to come, or in the presence of a catalyst, the market recognizes what you've been saying all this while, and accords a much higher fair value to it.

You can do various variants of this, by being activist (creating the catalyst yourself), or by being the traditional passive investor (believing that someday the catalyst would come as long as you buy at substantially below the intrinsic value), but ultimately, it still means that you'd need to take up positions when the merits are not widely obvious yet.

[chialc88]

just to add another point...

one must invest in a sum that's meaningful to your portfolio.

anyone can claims the number of multi-baggers he "discovered" 
simply by buying a large number of different counters.

this will inflate one ego but not THE wallet.

EXCELLENT call by buying at its low and amazing amount.
Specially for you, my dear:

[ksir]

On the incentive alignment of Management & Parent Co with minority shareholders, FWIW:
Note: below not based on hard data but rather based on my years of observation of the co and of course my flaws in fully interpret the data.
1. Parent co in this case I refer to BBR Swiss, since at least, they bear the name and largest shareholder. Also they are proud of the technology advantage of BBR.

Their interest may not aligned with minority shareholders, which we can see from the lack of dividends (could be due to whatever circumstances).

2. Management in this case, of course is mainly CEO and also Chairman.
CEO stake is about 5% and looking at his pay, the dividend would not be substantial as compared to “Expand and Boast” the company projects (even with negative margin), which are added to his CV and thence his image?

From the structure, it seems to me that the interest is not aligned.
To change that, Controlling parties has to change.

[karlmarx]

In this case it seems very obvious that somebody seems to know what is happening behind the scenes and is buying in anticipation. 

Very difficult for the layman to have conviction in such a story till the story is out!!!

Maybe they do, or maybe they don't. Regardless, I personally think it is not a good habit to buy when you do not understand what is going on.

Such occurrences are not uncommon in the market. I have missed out on all of such opportunities, especially those that lead to a buy out or large dividend. But I don't expect myself to be able to pick the winning stock of the day/week/month all the time. I only hope that I am correct in those I have chosen.

[TTTI]

On the incentive alignment of Management & Parent Co with minority shareholders, FWIW:
Note: below not based on hard data but rather based on my years of observation of the co and of course my flaws in fully interpret the data.
1. Parent co in this case I refer to BBR Swiss, since at least, they bear the name and largest shareholder. Also they are proud of the technology advantage of BBR.

Their interest may not aligned with minority shareholders, which we can see from the lack of dividends (could be due to whatever circumstances).

2. Management in this case, of course is mainly CEO and also Chairman.
CEO stake is about 5% and looking at his pay, the dividend would not be substantial as compared to “Expand and Boast” the company projects (even with negative margin), which are added to his CV and thence his image?

From the structure, it seems to me that the interest is not aligned.
To change that, Controlling parties has to change.

This is really just something technical and prob unimportant, but since you brought it up, just want to comment that the name doesn't mean it's the "parent company"
You could technically, incorporate a "ksirownsBBR Pte Ltd" company and buy 0.00001% of the company. Don't think "ksirownsBBR" will be the parent company. Anyhow, that's not really important.

As for the 2nd point about shareholder alignment with the interests of management, that's up for interpretation.
I don't think one can tell whether there's alignment of interests JUST by looking at the dividends, or the personal stake of the CEO.

I do agree with you though, that the fates of the management and the shareholders are not perfectly aligned.
Just that I don't think you can tell from looking at the div payout or Andrew Tan's stake.
(My conclusion is derived from my personal interactions with the CEO and Chairman)