S’pore is now richest in the world

[freedom]

Anyway base on our Fiat Monetised economy system, GOVS of the world will keep on printing more more paper money to keep the world economy from collapsing; That's one of the main reasons why you will need more and more fiat paper money to buy less and less things.

to simply accuse government around the world of printing money is too biased.

the advance of the world economy itself requires more and more money to be printed, otherwise, we are going to experience deflation constantly, which of course only benefits those who are older.

The younger generation, though more productive, will earn much less due to limited supply of money.

I think there are some grounds to Temperament's statement. After all, who else can you blame for excessive money printing?

Money printing occurs becos govts wish to intervene in the workings of the economy thru monetary policies. Of cos whether this is desirable then depends if you are a believer in Keynesian or Austrian economic theories.

It's really ok to earn less in absolute value in a deflationary environment, so long as ur real wage improves.

you can't ignore how bad it was during the Great Depression or current Japan economy.

In current Japan economy, it has been constantly in a deflationary environment. The elders are much richer than the younger generation, but they don't spend much as they are old. So the elders are starving the youngers.

Is this a healthy economy?

Of course, we can't say all money printing is good. but to say all money printing is bad is simply too biased.

[Muck]

On my understanding that real wages have not risen in the past decade for Japan, I'd guess it's not desirable. But my view is of course less impt than wat the avg Jap thinks

Monetary policy never rescued the GD nor the Jap economy leh...

[KopiKat]

you can't ignore how bad it was during the Great Depression or current Japan economy.

In current Japan economy, it has been constantly in a deflationary environment. The elders are much richer than the younger generation, but they don't spend much as they are old. So the elders are starving the youngers.

Is this a healthy economy?

Of course, we can't say all money printing is good. but to say all money printing is bad is simply too biased.

I wouldn't have realised it was that bad in Japan until I read your post and did a search and read a few news articles...

I visited Japan a couple of times during the past 2 years. It looked as bustling and vibrant as ever, especially in the City Centres (Tokyo, Osaka, Hakata-Fukuoka). In the outlying areas, it does appear quite deserted but I thought it was due to their off-peak tourist season. Things certainly doesn't look cheaper to me. Despite the strong S$, the Yen was even stronger when I was there...

[hyom]

So hire 1500 china bus drivers? I actually spoke up in a MP dialogue session, and suggested that companies hire 40 to 65 years workers... provide them with daily 30 min exercise, improve their health, and hire them for F&B, bus drivers.

When the elderly workers have $, they wont ask for $. When the workers exercise everyday, they will fall sick less --> less spending on health... Went down to the drain of course.

Dialogue??? Conclusion already made... it's just steering people to the conclusion they want...

I respect your courage to speak up. I only dare to "speak up" anonymously online.

A national crisis is brewing. It is the scarcity of babies. I guess what irks people like Contrarian who emphathize with the younger generation is that throughout the debate about babies, it was not mentioned that the government has a role to play by keeping cost of living down and making sure HDB build enough new flats. I think Contrarian probably has kids who are just starting out and facing cost of living problems now.

The affordable flats relative to income are the new flats, not resale flats. Since the last general election, Khaw Boon Wan has done a good job building more new flats for young couples. Building enough new flats and pricing HDBs closer to cost (not market price minus "subsidy") are things which are within the control of our government. We cannot blame government if high cost of living is caused by uncontrollable factors like rising wheat price. But if cost of living is caused by man-made policies, please do not dismiss any suggestion from the ground too quickly.

Without enough new flats, young couples have to wait for a long time before they can get a new flat. Buying from the resale market is very expensive for young couples even if both hold a degree. Going on long-term debt without a stable job is risky. Without an affordable shelter, couples will postpone marriage. When they marry late, they cannot have many babies because the woman has physical constraints. Baby production will be affected for these young couples even if they are not the selfish type as pointed out by KopiKat and yeowiki.

Hi KopiKat and yeowiki,

Many years ago, there was a thread on "Investing in a baby" in the old WallStraits forum. I pointed out some advantages to having babies. The founder of WallStraits hinted in his reply that I was some brainwashed unthinking citizen who just follow what the government said. Those who disagreed with me mentioned about not contributing to overpopulation and not wanting to bring in babies to suffer in this world. When I said Singapore's problem is not overpopulation but quite the reverse, the reply I got was that it is hypocritical of developed countries to encourage their own citizens to have babies while at the same time discourage citizens of poor countries not to have babies.

The real unstated reason was selfishness on the part of couples not wanting to make the sacrifice for having babies. Both of you have hit the nail on the head. I felt indignant that those who did not want babies hide behind noble reasons like not wanting to bring in babies to suffer in this world (not true if they are at least middle-class).

Babies are sensitive issue to childless couples because some of them may be infertile. It is not convenient for casual acquaintance to ask. However, for close friends whom I know well, I do urge them to consider having one. Got money to buy car, no money to have a baby? I have babies but no car.

d.o.g. once gave an interesting calculation on the present value of a baby by discounting on the likely future expenses of raising one. The cold hard truth was that it does not make financial sense to have a baby. One cannot help but agree with him. So what? I went on to have more babies.

[freedom]

On my understanding that real wages have not risen in the past decade for Japan, I'd guess it's not desirable. But my view is of course less impt than wat the avg Jap thinks

Monetary policy never rescued the GD nor the Jap economy leh...

you are kinda contradicting your own opinion.

if it is deflationary, how could real wage improve?

or if the real wage improves, would it be more natural that price starts to rise so inflationary again.

it would be difficult to be in a deflationary environment for long if real wage was improving.

but in a constantly deflationary environment, real wage most likely will fall further and further.

[KopiKat]

Babies are sensitive issue to childless couples because some of them may be infertile. It is not convenient for casual acquaintance to ask. However, for close friends whom I know well, I do urge them to consider having one. Got money to buy car, no money to have a baby? I have babies but no car.

I do know of more than a handful of people who're not that well off but who're unable to have kids. Some go through the expensive (previously, can't even use MediSave) and painful (regular injections for the wife) program of IVF / IUF because they want to have kids. The chances of success gets lower with age. That doesn't deter them from multiple attempts. At the end, faced with failure, some go for the path of adoptions. An equally expensive and long process, full of unknowns and uncertainty.

Now, ask yourself why some married couples will go through such 'extremes' just to have kids? Political 'brain-washing' is so effective? Those of us who love kids and are willing to lower our lifestyle expectations are considered so easy to 'brain-wash'? Big joke...

[Musicwhiz]

I guess for myself, having kids has always represented a "complete family". But I know many of my friends who are married may not see it that way. For them, marriage is for companionship and they do not see a need for kids.

[Muck]

On my understanding that real wages have not risen in the past decade for Japan, I'd guess it's not desirable. But my view is of course less impt than wat the avg Jap thinks

Monetary policy never rescued the GD nor the Jap economy leh...

you are kinda contradicting your own opinion.

if it is deflationary, how could real wage improve?

or if the real wage improves, would it be more natural that price starts to rise so inflationary again.

it would be difficult to be in a deflationary environment for long if real wage was improving.

but in a constantly deflationary environment, real wage most likely will fall further and further.

hmm... i really meant deflation in general, not wage deflation. could you be meaning the latter? perhaps that explains the disjoint in our views?

deflation as i understand it is the general decrease in prices of goods. so if wages remain the same, or decrease less than the general prices of goods, than real wages would have increased.

if i may, would like to quote a research paper on "Deflation, Real Wages, and the International Great Depression: A Productivity Puzzle" by the Fed Reserve Bank of Minneapolis:

"The high real wage hypothesis is one of the leading stories for how deflation caused the International Depression (see Eichengreen and Sachs (1985) Bernanke and Carey (1994), and Bernanke (1995)). A simple version of this story is that world-wide decreases in the money supply led to worldwide deflation, which in turn raised real wages across countries through incomplete nominal wage adjustment. The second part of the story is that higher real wages then reduced employment as firms moved up their labor demand curves to equate the higher real wage with a higher marginal product of labor."

i thank you for your fair comment that (i) it would be difficult to be in a deflationary environment for long if real wage was improving; and (ii) in a constantly deflationary environment, real wage most likely will fall further and further.

appreciate any views contrary to my opinions anytime. after all, i'm really here to learn as much as to share views.

[Temperament]

Anyway base on our Fiat Monetised economy system, GOVS of the world will keep on printing more more paper money to keep the world economy from collapsing; That's one of the main reasons why you will need more and more fiat paper money to buy less and less things.

to simply accuse government around the world of printing money is too biased.

the advance of the world economy itself requires more and more money to be printed, otherwise, we are going to experience deflation constantly, which of course only benefits those who are older.

The younger generation, though more productive, will earn much less due to limited supply of money.

"the advance of the world economy itself requires more and more money to be printed, otherwise, we are going to experience deflation constantly, which of course only benefits those who are older."

unquote:-
1st i like you to know i had posted an article on the collapse of the money system based on Gold Standard.
So it is inevitable for Govs of the world to print more and more money to try to "control" their respective countries's economy.
i am not blaming any Govs but just state the facts of what's happening in our present world.
Try to read the article on the collapse of the money based on Gold Standard that i had posted.

For me Fiat money is very "strange".
It's getting stranger by the day.
It's only paper bearing the faith of The Govs who printed it.
And of course until now almost everyone still have the most faith in the so-called "Green Back"
As "Green -Back's" country is still the largest economy of the world.

[freedom]

to me the fiat money might not be perfect, but at least it is fairer than gold standard.

a simple question would be how gold standard would accommodate the explosion of global population or explosion of global technology or explosion of global asset in the last 100 years? Gold can't be obtained as fast as the population growth, neither as fast as the technology advancement of the last 50 years. so does that mean if we can't produce gold as fast as desired, the better technology should be of less value? the more productive younger generation should be of less worth than the elders just because they are born late?

abandoning gold standard is inevitable.