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Jardine Cycle & Carriage
22-06-2015, 06:54 AM.
Post: #21
RE: Jardine Cycle & Carriage
(21-06-2015, 02:43 PM)donmihaihai Wrote: it is just that Jardine is trying to get more shares in Jardine C&C.

That's my gut feel. A poorly disguised tactic to raise its stake (%) in C&C by shifting its money around. And they would be getting it as a discount too. (Besides the benefit of the regular 5% or so sleeping investors who will not do anything and thus forgoing their rights...) So its win win for Jardine lah. Big Grin

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22-06-2015, 08:00 PM. (This post was last modified: 22-06-2015, 08:01 PM by donmihaihai.)
Post: #22
RE: Jardine Cycle & Carriage
(22-06-2015, 06:54 AM)HitandRun Wrote:
(21-06-2015, 02:43 PM)donmihaihai Wrote: it is just that Jardine is trying to get more shares in Jardine C&C.

That's my gut feel. A poorly disguised tactic to raise its stake (%) in C&C by shifting its money around. And they would be getting it as a discount too. (Besides the benefit of the regular 5% or so sleeping investors who will not do anything and thus forgoing their rights...) So its win win for Jardine lah. Big Grin

Taking words out of context?

Quote:So is it that the non-listed segment that is in need of fund or it is just that Jardine is trying to get more shares in Jardine C&C or both.

Not sure if many understand what I was saying beside the fact that it was written in lousy English.

Anyway segment information in AR2014 show a better picture. Equity other than Astra stood at USD382.5M. Without this right issue, investor should be very worry on the USD615M investment. Servicing debts taken for this investment will kill Jardine C&C(flow of funds must be taken into consideration). Now who was worried? Anyone foresee this right issue?

Being the bad guy again

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23-06-2015, 06:45 AM.
Post: #23
RE: Jardine Cycle & Carriage
Jardine is a big group with varied interests. Who gets to decide which subsidiary house what business? Siam City Cement very synergistic with JC&C? I was just wondering why does Jardine decide to place it in JC&C in order to have the pleasure to fund it with some other group company wor. Big Grin

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28-06-2015, 10:49 PM.
Post: #24
Jardine Cycle & Carriage
Value is emerging. At current prices, my estimated earnings per share of USD2 would give it a PE of 13. A reasonable price for exposure to Indonesia's favorable demographics: young population and growing middle class.

Vested


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28-06-2015, 11:05 PM.
Post: #25
RE: Jardine Cycle & Carriage
In the Hongs we trust...

However, they are long term businessmen and hence must share long term view with them...

Trading Vested

(28-06-2015, 10:49 PM)vingaard Wrote: Value is emerging. At current prices, my estimated earnings per share of USD2 would give it a PE of 13. A reasonable price for exposure to Indonesia's favorable demographics: young population and growing middle class.

Vested


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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06-07-2015, 09:06 PM.
Post: #26
RE: Jardine Cycle & Carriage
JC&C price trading history since beginning 2015:

Jan 15 low 37.25, Mar 30 post announcement of buying 24.9% stake in siam city cement 39.25, 18 Jun date of announcement of rights 35.00, 19 Jun day after announcement 34.65, 24 Jun ex rights 34.21. Today 30.56 (all price adjusted for rights issue)

In mkt downturns, insti look at index linked ideas

One just need to look at taipan's history on building c&c into a south asian auto cum financial conglomerate.

These Taipans, commonly known as Hongs are the opium traders that forced the declining Ching dynasty to lease HK to Britain for 100 yrs:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keswick_family

http://www.btinvest.com.sg/personal_fina...-jardines/

They are always taking advantage of crisis to build new core business:

- 92 bot initial 16% stake from kuwait investment office post gulf war
- Few years later they bought and assumed Controlling stake from Chua family
- Y2k bot astra int'l from ibra 30% (which got astra stake from Salim Gp as debt repayment post AFC)
- did a rights issue @ $3/share
- Few years later majority
- Recent yrs peak > 50
Holcim restructuring post recent merger, rid sccc @ around 5 yr lows citing inability to assume bigger controlling stake
- J C&C bought 24.9% and rights @ S$26
- JSH owns close to 75% of JC&C. What if sccc turns out to be the next big core for the Hongs?
- Now c&c tanked right after x rights
- Apart from computer related arbi trades, I have no other explanations

Its appears to be an opportunity to ride with the Hongs

Hongs don't really care about their share price really. Its small investors like us that failed to see what Hongs are seeing...

Perhaps, its small investors like us that are constantly monitoring share price and panicking.

Vested
Trading Core
GG (green turning purple averaging down)

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06-07-2015, 11:33 PM.
Post: #27
RE: Jardine Cycle & Carriage
There is an article on this week's edition of The Edge Singapore on JCC.

-Holcim reportedly decided to sell SCC because it was unable to build up a majority position.

Is JCC satisfied with a 24.9% stake? If not, will it be able to increase its stake? Anybody know who is the other major shareholders of SCC, if any?

JCC acquired 30% of Astra in 2000. By 2006 , its stake has reached 50.1%.

- JCC says in its filing that 12% of rights proceed could go towards "strategic investment and/or acquisition". As of 15-Feb, JCC has acquired 21.6% stake in Refrigeration Electrical Engineering Corp, listed in Vietnam. This company business is in engineering, real estate and infrastructure.

Looks like JCC betting big on South East Asia. Since JSH owned more than 74% of JCC, the article thinks that JSH is using JCC to expand in the region.

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06-07-2015, 11:39 PM. (This post was last modified: 06-07-2015, 11:43 PM by greengiraffe.)
Post: #28
RE: Jardine Cycle & Carriage
http://www.siamcitycement.com/en/who_we_...ny_profile

http://www.siamcitycement.com/en/investor/yearly

http://www.siamcitycement.com/en/investor/information

Seems like no holder controlling majority stake... Taipans seems to be eyeing another Astra in the making years down the road and can SCC expand into under developed Indo-China mkt?

Taipans also not virgin in Indo-China by virtues of its Vietnamese business experiences.

(06-07-2015, 11:33 PM)touzi Wrote: There is an article on this week's edition of The Edge Singapore on JCC.

-Holcim reportedly decided to sell SCC because it was unable to build up a majority position.

Is JCC satisfied with a 24.9% stake? If not, will it be able to increase its stake? Anybody know who is the other major shareholders of SCC, if any?

JCC acquired 30% of Astra in 2000. By 2006 , its stake has reached 50.1%.

- JCC says in its filing that 12% of rights proceed could go towards "strategic investment and/or acquisition". As of 15-Feb, JCC has acquired 21.6% stake in Refrigeration Electrical Engineering Corp, listed in Vietnam. This company business is in engineering, real estate and infrastructure.

Looks like JCC betting big on South East Asia. Since JSH owned more than 74% of JCC, the article thinks that JSH is using JCC to expand in the region.

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07-07-2015, 01:03 AM.
Post: #29
RE: Jardine Cycle & Carriage
The Rataranak family (one of Thailand's Godfather families - so GG should love them) owns roughly 45% of Siam City Cement, which is considered one of their core companies, apart from their family bank (Bank Ayudhya) and Bangkok Broadcasting & Television. They used to have more than 50% of SCC, but sold down post-Asian financial crisis to Holcim to deleverage the company.

SCC has a very stable business, and pays a good dividend every year. But not sure what is driving JC&C to pay 18x+ average past 3 years earnings to buy a minority zho-bo-lan stake.

This company is different from the Siam Cement Group (SCG), which is a massive conglomerate in its own right. But SCG belongs to the King of Thailand (THE Godfather whom all godfathers in Thailand have to call lau-peh).

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07-07-2015, 08:15 AM.
Post: #30
RE: Jardine Cycle & Carriage
Godfather + Opium Taipans = GOT lobangs...

Thanks for the headsup... I love it...

Like I say, the only thing for us is if we have the stamina to ride with the GOTs and eventually see what they are working out for...

One thing is for sure, Taipans are unlikely to be passive investor in an expensive CBL stake.

No Worries
Trading Vested
GG

(07-07-2015, 01:03 AM)thefarside Wrote: The Rataranak family (one of Thailand's Godfather families - so GG should love them) owns roughly 45% of Siam City Cement, which is considered one of their core companies, apart from their family bank (Bank Ayudhya) and Bangkok Broadcasting & Television. They used to have more than 50% of SCC, but sold down post-Asian financial crisis to Holcim to deleverage the company.

SCC has a very stable business, and pays a good dividend every year. But not sure what is driving JC&C to pay 18x+ average past 3 years earnings to buy a minority zho-bo-lan stake.

This company is different from the Siam Cement Group (SCG), which is a massive conglomerate in its own right. But SCG belongs to the King of Thailand (THE Godfather whom all godfathers in Thailand have to call lau-peh).

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