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(03-04-2013, 10:06 AM)Musicwhiz Wrote: (03-04-2013, 10:03 AM)sgd Wrote: out of 10 in this forum I will say 1 or 2 are real true value investors. The rest just taking on the name only.
How would you determine if a person was a "real" value investor or just in name? I think you would have to observe his behaviour as well as performance over an extended period of time, right? Therefore, what makes you conclude that only about 10% to 20% of the forumers here represent ""true" value investors? 
Exactly !
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03-04-2013, 10:38 AM
(This post was last modified: 03-04-2013, 10:40 AM by sgd.)
(03-04-2013, 10:06 AM)Musicwhiz Wrote: (03-04-2013, 10:03 AM)sgd Wrote: out of 10 in this forum I will say 1 or 2 are real true value investors. The rest just taking on the name only.
How would you determine if a person was a "real" value investor or just in name? I think you would have to observe his behaviour as well as performance over an extended period of time, right? Therefore, what makes you conclude that only about 10% to 20% of the forumers here represent ""true" value investors?
Just to give an example I think one of the very few deserving for the title "value investor" I think will have to go to dxdy. I see the stocks he follows from wallstraits days until now and that's like 4-5 years ago already. I don't see many like that around I'm sure there are others like him maybe lurking around but I think very few out of the many in this forum. I think maybe the rest are mixed kind of investors maybe 60%-70% of the time they are value investors.
Myself from wallstraits time to afralug to now VB but I don't consider myself true value investor I have some dividend stocks but I also buy and sell whatever opportunity present itself. If the stock cheong very high and there is good profit If I sell why not if it tanks and the yield shoots up I will buy. My only discipline is I don't short don't borrow don't leverage and no contraing either is just my way and preference. So my only play is usually buy low and sell high whether is for short term or speculate or for dividend.
So if you look at a counter like challenger already gone up so high is a good stock I agree but I will not buy it because I am a buy low to sell high kind of investor, if it tanks maybe I will jump in because I know the value investors are monitoring the yield and will buy on weakness also so there's a chance the stock will recover in time so I will buy if there's opportunity. Is good to follow value investors crowd because they will stay commit no matter what kind of weather 
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(03-04-2013, 10:06 AM)Musicwhiz Wrote: (03-04-2013, 10:03 AM)sgd Wrote: out of 10 in this forum I will say 1 or 2 are real true value investors. The rest just taking on the name only.
How would you determine if a person was a "real" value investor or just in name? I think you would have to observe his behaviour as well as performance over an extended period of time, right? Therefore, what makes you conclude that only about 10% to 20% of the forumers here represent ""true" value investors?
As long as the performance consistently better than the benchmark, and continue growing of fund, it doesn't matter the name labelled.  I am quite sure we will not have any privilege in investing after named as "real" value investor.
“夏则资皮，冬则资纱，旱则资船，水则资车” - 范蠡
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(03-04-2013, 10:41 AM)CityFarmer Wrote: (03-04-2013, 10:06 AM)Musicwhiz Wrote: (03-04-2013, 10:03 AM)sgd Wrote: out of 10 in this forum I will say 1 or 2 are real true value investors. The rest just taking on the name only.
How would you determine if a person was a "real" value investor or just in name? I think you would have to observe his behaviour as well as performance over an extended period of time, right? Therefore, what makes you conclude that only about 10% to 20% of the forumers here represent ""true" value investors?
As long as the performance consistently better than the benchmark, and continue growing of fund, it doesn't matter the name labelled. I am quite sure we will not have any privilege in investing after named as "real" value investor. As long as i can make enough to cover my yearly expenses i am quite happy already.
WB:-
1) Rule # 1, do not lose money.
2) Rule # 2, refer to # 1.
3) Not until you can manage your emotions, you can manage your money.
Truism of Investments.
A) Buying a security is buying RISK not Return
B) You can control RISK (to a certain level, hopefully only.) But definitely not the outcome of the Return.
NB:-
My signature is meant for psychoing myself. No offence to anyone. i am trying not to lose money unnecessary anymore.
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03-04-2013, 11:03 AM
(This post was last modified: 03-04-2013, 11:04 AM by mobo.)
No offence to anyone, but one disturbing trend I notice here and people I personally know around me is their tendency to equate value investing as fundamental analysis and/or investments and the rest as trading or speculators.
There are many competing philosophies towards portfolio management of which value seeking is just one of the many. The reason why it has gained so much prominence is I believe due to a few celebrities like Warren Buffet, Charlie Munger, Jason Zweig and to a lesser extent people like Templeton and Peter Lynch who are seen to be practicing some form of diluted value investing principle.
Many mutual fund companies know that laymen are attracted to the term "value investing" and thus actively reinforce this image by advertising their fund strategies as value based.
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(03-04-2013, 11:03 AM)mobo Wrote: No offence to anyone, but one disturbing trend I notice here and people I personally know around me is their tendency to equate value investing as fundamental analysis and/or investments and the rest as trading or speculators.
There are many competing philosophies towards portfolio management of which value seeking is just one of the many. The reason why it has gained so much prominence is I believe due to a few celebrities like Warren Buffet, Charlie Munger, Jason Zweig and to a lesser extent people like Templeton and Peter Lynch who are seen to be practicing some form of diluted value investing principle.
Many mutual fund companies know that laymen are attracted to the term "value investing" and thus actively reinforce this image by advertising their fund strategies as value based.
It's becoming a bit like religions... The Ultra Orthodox sect branding the rest as Infidels...
I don't quite agree with the statement ' Templeton and Peter Lynch who are seen to be practicing some form of diluted value investing principle'. I don't see it as a form of dilution. The fundamental cornerstone is the same ie. Intrinsic Value, Margin of Safety.. It's the application that's different and IMO, they're successful in their own rights as they've managed to grasp the concepts and adapted it to their own Temperament/Character + Area of Competence. 
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To me it's all semantics only.
No matter who you are, what you are, you must buy & sell. Sell and buy. We are all traders. Only we trade "differently". Only some of us like to think we are investors. The real investors you should known who they are. In fact, WB is considered more an business investor than trader. How many of us have bought and keep a counter for more than 10 to 30 years? Very few of us indeed.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trader_(finance)
A trader is a person or entity, in finance, who buys and sells financial instruments such as stocks, bonds, commodities and derivatives, in the capacity of agent
WB:-
1) Rule # 1, do not lose money.
2) Rule # 2, refer to # 1.
3) Not until you can manage your emotions, you can manage your money.
Truism of Investments.
A) Buying a security is buying RISK not Return
B) You can control RISK (to a certain level, hopefully only.) But definitely not the outcome of the Return.
NB:-
My signature is meant for psychoing myself. No offence to anyone. i am trying not to lose money unnecessary anymore.
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(03-04-2013, 12:49 PM)Temperament Wrote: To me it's all semantics only.
No matter who you are, what you are, you must buy & sell. Sell and buy. We are all traders. Only we trade "differently". Only some of us like to think we are investors. The real investors you should known who they are. In fact, WB is considered more an business investor than trader. How many of us have bought and keep a counter for more than 10 to 30 years? Very few of us indeed.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trader_(finance)
A trader is a person or entity, in finance, who buys and sells financial instruments such as stocks, bonds, commodities and derivatives, in the capacity of agent
I have kept my counters for more than 10 years. I will only sell if there is a fundamental change to the company.
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(03-04-2013, 12:54 PM)a74henry Wrote: (03-04-2013, 12:49 PM)Temperament Wrote: To me it's all semantics only.
No matter who you are, what you are, you must buy & sell. Sell and buy. We are all traders. Only we trade "differently". Only some of us like to think we are investors. The real investors you should known who they are. In fact, WB is considered more an business investor than trader. How many of us have bought and keep a counter for more than 10 to 30 years? Very few of us indeed.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trader_(finance)
A trader is a person or entity, in finance, who buys and sells financial instruments such as stocks, bonds, commodities and derivatives, in the capacity of agent
I have kept my counters for more than 10 years. I will only sell if there is a fundamental change to the company.
i have HWP for more than 25 years by design or more by default because i were an ex-employee . From HWP, i have A. (AGILENT-HWP spin-off and a local spin-off which has been de-listed). How i wish i was working for "IBM" or "Microsoft" instead. Too bad.
i understand the point of a real investor in a company. The only caveat is when the fundamentals of a great company changes, can i still sell at the price when the company is in its pink of health? Or can i get out in time, without giving back all the profit on paper?
The only caveat(fear) of an investor is only imagination? NO? YES?
WB:-
1) Rule # 1, do not lose money.
2) Rule # 2, refer to # 1.
3) Not until you can manage your emotions, you can manage your money.
Truism of Investments.
A) Buying a security is buying RISK not Return
B) You can control RISK (to a certain level, hopefully only.) But definitely not the outcome of the Return.
NB:-
My signature is meant for psychoing myself. No offence to anyone. i am trying not to lose money unnecessary anymore.
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