Sino Grandness

haha.. you got me. Now I am vested in Sino Grandness, China Minzhong and Dukang Distillers. Seriously considering to liquidate all tomorrow.

(26-08-2013, 09:59 PM)Wildreamz Wrote: haha.. you got me. Now I am vested in Sino Grandness, China Minzhong and Dukang Distillers. Seriously considering to liquidate all tomorrow.

Maybe switch them all to Yanlord and Yangzijiang. The only 2 china stocks that pay a consistent dividends and have solid cashflow.

The key is the management of the company.
I also like CAO which has been reborn from its ashes with stronger risk management and increase flights in China.

(26-08-2013, 10:00 PM)propertyinvestor Wrote:

(26-08-2013, 09:59 PM)Wildreamz Wrote: haha.. you got me. Now I am vested in Sino Grandness, China Minzhong and Dukang Distillers. Seriously considering to liquidate all tomorrow.

Maybe switch them all to Yanlord and Yangzijiang. The only 2 china stocks that pay a consistent dividends and have solid cashflow.

Now, I only want to invest in obviously undervalued stock that generate lots of free cash flow, with good management credibility and preferably a wide economic moat.

(26-08-2013, 10:00 PM)propertyinvestor Wrote:

(26-08-2013, 09:59 PM)Wildreamz Wrote: haha.. you got me. Now I am vested in Sino Grandness, China Minzhong and Dukang Distillers. Seriously considering to liquidate all tomorrow.

Maybe switch them all to Yanlord and Yangzijiang. The only 2 china stocks that pay a consistent dividends and have solid cashflow.

Buy companies that have listed companies or at least renowned companies as customers, its easy to track the purchase and sale from both sides. For YZJ, the main products is ships, you can track the contracts it entered into with most of its customers as they are also listed, there are also third party shipping news website that track the industry ship building, so I have 2 sources to confirm if there deals and announcements are real.

But to be honest, I have no way of tracking its 12 billion HTM. I think its a good idea to just chill and reflect, better to take a short break from the trading.

I was all emo when I lost almost all my savings in CAO, and felt conned by QIngmei's Chairman who keep selling its stake, so to make good my loss, I brought more of Hu An cable and Fuxing, big mistake! Lost even more, its not a good idea to buy or sell when one is feeling down. Take a break, the market will always be there.

Take care

Eratat gives dividend too ^^

more than 20cents in cash but interest party sells all his shares at 13.8 cents.......

if china 'blows' up....YZJ's cash lending to SME will 'blow' up......

by the way I stopped looking at Sino when I look at its depreciation rate.....plants and machinery that seems indestructible

(26-08-2013, 10:00 PM)propertyinvestor Wrote:

(26-08-2013, 09:59 PM)Wildreamz Wrote: haha.. you got me. Now I am vested in Sino Grandness, China Minzhong and Dukang Distillers. Seriously considering to liquidate all tomorrow.

Maybe switch them all to Yanlord and Yangzijiang. The only 2 china stocks that pay a consistent dividends and have solid cashflow.

Hi Behappyalways

Cld u elaborate "plants and machinery that seems indestructible"?

many tks

(26-08-2013, 10:31 PM)Behappyalways Wrote: Eratat gives dividend too ^^

more than 20cents in cash but interest party sells all his shares at 13.8 cents.......



if china 'blows' up....YZJ's cash lending to SME will 'blow' up......

by the way I stopped looking at Sino when I look at its depreciation rate.....plants and machinery that seems indestructible

(26-08-2013, 10:00 PM)propertyinvestor Wrote:

(26-08-2013, 09:59 PM)Wildreamz Wrote: haha.. you got me. Now I am vested in Sino Grandness, China Minzhong and Dukang Distillers. Seriously considering to liquidate all tomorrow.

Maybe switch them all to Yanlord and Yangzijiang. The only 2 china stocks that pay a consistent dividends and have solid cashflow.

normally investors just look at P/L without digging into the Balance sheet and cashflow.......

when we read the newspapers, they also announced just the P/L.......like for example AAA company announces 50% profit growth and etc.... but in reality how 'clean' is the P/L


In order to publish a good set of P/L, mgmt might be tempted to under depreciate their equipment, under provide for loss in trade receivables and doubtful debts...etc etc.....

For an expanding company buying lots of new equip (Sino expands into drink biz), typically their depreciation is higher while an 'old' company has lower depreciation as most of their assets might have been fully depreciated($1 book value).

typically......computers and accessories' depreciation rate is 33% or 3 years, cars 5-10 years, land....depending on freehold and leasehold.....and machineries....typically I give around 10 years....(you wouldn't want to see your food company still using the same machinery after 50 years......). If 10 years, depreciation rate is around 10%.......

So as an estimate, normally I use a 10% depreciation rate to gauge 'healthy' P/L.

If you are interested to read more about depreciation, one typically company you can look at is Sunright......They are in semiconductor biz where it is fast moving so equip tends to depreciate very fast......look at their depreciation rate....look at how it affects their bottom line....

different industries have different depreciation rate......fast growth companies or high tech companies tends to have higher depreciation rate so it varies......but as a rule of thumb an asset like plant and machinery should be depreciated within 10 years....that's my personal view...but some companies think that they can use their machines for 50 years ...or more ^^

Queried by sgx. Standard questions again.

http://infopub.sgx.com/Apps?A=COW_Corpor...hwqDCcaySN

Hi Behappyalways,

thank you for your comments about Sino's depreciation rate. I looked up their AR 2012. Page 43 states depreciation at 15m RMB. Their notes on page page 44, 2(a) and further on page 50 states depreciation of machinery and equipment as 10 years.

i am not good at reading ARs. have I missed something?

tks your advice,

* been looking to invest

(27-08-2013, 11:41 AM)Behappyalways Wrote: normally investors just look at P/L without digging into the Balance sheet and cashflow.......

when we read the newspapers, they also announced just the P/L.......like for example AAA company announces 50% profit growth and etc.... but in reality how 'clean' is the P/L


In order to publish a good set of P/L, mgmt might be tempted to under depreciate their equipment, under provide for loss in trade receivables and doubtful debts...etc etc.....

For an expanding company buying lots of new equip (Sino expands into drink biz), typically their depreciation is higher while an 'old' company has lower depreciation as most of their assets might have been fully depreciated($1 book value).

typically......computers and accessories' depreciation rate is 33% or 3 years, cars 5-10 years, land....depending on freehold and leasehold.....and machineries....typically I give around 10 years....(you wouldn't want to see your food company still using the same machinery after 50 years......). If 10 years, depreciation rate is around 10%.......

So as an estimate, normally I use a 10% depreciation rate to gauge 'healthy' P/L.

If you are interested to read more about depreciation, one typically company you can look at is Sunright......They are in semiconductor biz where it is fast moving so equip tends to depreciate very fast......look at their depreciation rate....look at how it affects their bottom line....

different industries have different depreciation rate......fast growth companies or high tech companies tends to have higher depreciation rate so it varies......but as a rule of thumb an asset like plant and machinery should be depreciated within 10 years....that's my personal view...but some companies think that they can use their machines for 50 years ...or more ^^