Sino Grandness

i thought this is more of a manifestation of what Huang had mentioned earlier many times that bondholders want to get a stake in the new company and were happy to wait for the ipo. The shortist could view this negatively though...that huang has no money to repay the bondholders and is asking for more times...

(29-06-2015, 06:57 PM)Aldar Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 05:32 PM)crubs Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 04:26 PM)Behappyalways Wrote: Look at F&N associate Fung Choi Media.

What relevance does this have with Sino ? Are you saying all associates are loss making ?

I think what he meant was despite how reputable some parent companies may be, some still make bad investment decisions - an example would be F&N's investment in Fung Choi Media.

Yeah you are right..but in the case of Sino, the Thai's made the investment with eyes wide open post Newman9 report. Would not they be more thorough with their checks?

(09-04-2015, 08:48 PM)BlueKelah Wrote: looking at non-alcoholic beverages, Hangzhou Wahaha and Bright Food (Group) are probably the major players in china and would make better investments for investor wanting exposure to chinese beverage market.

basing its future business success on just loquat line sounds a bit far fetched IMHO. There are so many other more prominent drinks and fruit juices to compete with.

SinoG should perhaps concentrate more on its core canning business. Usually when company try to expand new business and not look after its core business, the story doesn't end well.

like many of the s-chip, this is a pretty speculative/volatile counter. Fortunately for those vested, the CHina and HK stock markets are on steriods at the moment, so could be plenty more upside in the short term. When "investing" in such companies, it is a gamble at best, so analysing the business and fundamentals are just a waste of time. Just put some money in with a strict cut loss and see how far it can run would be the best way to go.

To note, before all the garden fresh IPO hoohah, this S-chip was only 10-20cents, it is likely that should the chinese/hk markets continue to sink, those speculating in this stock will be caught unawares.

(29-06-2015, 08:54 PM)leeeta Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 06:57 PM)Aldar Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 05:32 PM)crubs Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 04:26 PM)Behappyalways Wrote: Look at F&N associate Fung Choi Media.

What relevance does this have with Sino ? Are you saying all associates are loss making ?

I think what he meant was despite how reputable some parent companies may be, some still make bad investment decisions - an example would be F&N's investment in Fung Choi Media.

Yeah you are right..but in the case of Sino, the Thai's made the investment with eyes wide open post Newman9 report. Would not they be more thorough with their checks?

I have no idea about their due diligence procedures.

But investors/speculators who bought into the company must pray that the HK/China stock market volatility will cease soon - such volatility will only hamper any potential IPOs.

Good luck!

(29-06-2015, 08:54 PM)leeeta Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 06:57 PM)Aldar Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 05:32 PM)crubs Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 04:26 PM)Behappyalways Wrote: Look at F&N associate Fung Choi Media.

What relevance does this have with Sino ? Are you saying all associates are loss making ?

I think what he meant was despite how reputable some parent companies may be, some still make bad investment decisions - an example would be F&N's investment in Fung Choi Media.

Yeah you are right..but in the case of Sino, the Thai's made the investment with eyes wide open post Newman9 report. Would not they be more thorough with their checks?

F&N (beverage) step into Fung Choi media (media) , in an industry which i am not sure their experty and familiarity lies.

For TTA which is the Thais, their investment into sino grandness defnitely rings a bell in their camp. Thai coffee king seeing potential to be juice king.
And they are aware that this is S-chip..... Wont they be extra more cautious in their auditing ? I would to think that they are very intelligent.

(29-06-2015, 09:45 PM)fattboy Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 08:54 PM)leeeta Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 06:57 PM)Aldar Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 05:32 PM)crubs Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 04:26 PM)Behappyalways Wrote: Look at F&N associate Fung Choi Media.

What relevance does this have with Sino ? Are you saying all associates are loss making ?

I think what he meant was despite how reputable some parent companies may be, some still make bad investment decisions - an example would be F&N's investment in Fung Choi Media.

Yeah you are right..but in the case of Sino, the Thai's made the investment with eyes wide open post Newman9 report. Would not they be more thorough with their checks?

F&N (beverage) step into Fung Choi media (media) , in an industry which i am not sure their experty and familiarity lies.

For TTA which is the Thais, their investment into sino grandness defnitely rings a bell in their camp. Thai coffee king seeing potential to be juice king.
And they are aware that this is S-chip..... Wont they be extra more cautious in their auditing ? I would to think that they are very intelligent.

F&N was a conglomerate with interests in beverage, property and media (publishing and printing) before the dividend in specie of FCL. You should read more about F&N here (http://www.fraserandneave.com/our-businesses).

And unlike the Chearavanont family (CP Group), I don't think the Mahagitsiri family has knowledge of the China business environment, much less of S-Chips.

Addendum: if CP Group (with its strong distribution network of CP All-owned 7-11 stores and Siam Makro) or Thai Bev were to invest in Sino, it would be a good signal since the products would enjoy better synergies.

I'm not so sure about the Mahagitsiri's ability to introduce another juice drink and make it a success in the cutthroat Thai juice market (UFC, Malee Sampran). The juice market and instant coffee market are very different. Also, Nestle is a well-known global brand while gardenfresh is not really notable outside of China/HK.

It'll help if you have close friends or family in Thailand or visit the supermarkets/convenience stores in Thailand when you are trying to determine the odds of Mahagitsiri successfully introducing loquat juice to Thai taste buds.

And even in the unlikely event if it gains some popularity, local competitors will just copy and create loquat juices as well.

Anyway, I don't see much value in the continued discussions about the fundamental analysis of this stock currently.

The last time Momo Eagle tried warning others about Eratat, he/ she was whacked like crazy by vested interests (some of whom created multiple accounts and left comments which are not insightful).

I would like to clarify that:

1. I do not have vested interests

2. I do not see value in comprehensive analysis currently as the binary event (IPO or no IPO) will take place by the end of July

The main catalyst for this stock is the IPO of Gardenfresh.

In my opinion, discussions should be about the consequences of an IPO or no IPO - If there's an IPO, what's the potential upside. If there's no IPO, whether SinoG can repay the CBs/ what's the potential downside.

Then you'll understand the risk/reward.

Hmm, in Eratat case, the CEO/controlling shareholder did not make any share purchases.

In SinoGrand case, its CEO has made share purchases in Oct 2014 and Mar 2015. Judging by the share purchases, SinoGrand should be more sound than Eratat.

Not vested in SinoGrand; just watching from the sidelines.

Quote:SinoGrand should be more sound than Eratat.

The crux here is that the IPO application was not submitted to HKSE.
There are many possible interpretations out of this event - SG prefers not to IPO, SG has money to pay bondholders, SG wants to depress the share price or whatever.
However, to the logical mind, it does not seem logical not to submit IPO application if it can reduce the bond payment.

For anything that is not logical, it is possibly better to leave it to those who know SG so well that they can make sense out of an illogical decision. But I suppose most minority shareholders doesn't even know why IPO was not submitted.

(29-06-2015, 11:43 PM)Aldar Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 09:45 PM)fattboy Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 08:54 PM)leeeta Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 06:57 PM)Aldar Wrote:

(29-06-2015, 05:32 PM)crubs Wrote: What relevance does this have with Sino ? Are you saying all associates are loss making ?

I think what he meant was despite how reputable some parent companies may be, some still make bad investment decisions - an example would be F&N's investment in Fung Choi Media.

Yeah you are right..but in the case of Sino, the Thai's made the investment with eyes wide open post Newman9 report. Would not they be more thorough with their checks?

F&N (beverage) step into Fung Choi media (media) , in an industry which i am not sure their experty and familiarity lies.

For TTA which is the Thais, their investment into sino grandness defnitely rings a bell in their camp. Thai coffee king seeing potential to be juice king.
And they are aware that this is S-chip..... Wont they be extra more cautious in their auditing ? I would to think that they are very intelligent.

F&N was a conglomerate with interests in beverage, property and media (publishing and printing) before the dividend in specie of FCL. You should read more about F&N here (http://www.fraserandneave.com/our-businesses).

And unlike the Chearavanont family (CP Group), I don't think the Mahagitsiri family has knowledge of the China business environment, much less of S-Chips.

Addendum: if CP Group (with its strong distribution network of CP All-owned 7-11 stores and Siam Makro) or Thai Bev were to invest in Sino, it would be a good signal since the products would enjoy better synergies.

I'm not so sure about the Mahagitsiri's ability to introduce another juice drink and make it a success in the cutthroat Thai juice market (UFC, Malee Sampran). The juice market and instant coffee market are very different. Also, Nestle is a well-known global brand while gardenfresh is not really notable outside of China/HK.

It'll help if you have close friends or family in Thailand or visit the supermarkets/convenience stores in Thailand when you are trying to determine the odds of Mahagitsiri successfully introducing loquat juice to Thai taste buds.

And even in the unlikely event if it gains some popularity, local competitors will just copy and create loquat juices as well.

I think it is relevent to do first do market behavior and trend survey which i would like to think they had or are capable of . The foundation for the level of success is dependant on the psychological of the targeted market via effective marketing channel and methods. Simply cant base on "friends & family" to determine the mass scene with such tiny sample group.

1. Can you name me which market in this world is not cut-throat , easy to do , any guarenttee profit?

2. Why do you think they have zero knowledge of the china market or have weak distribution channel ? You make them sound like a group of samaritans. Haha

3. Competition , also name me which product doesnt attracts competition? Maybe can recap of the supply to demand to production process of loquat and you might be able to preview on a wider perspective.


Anyway , i agree with you, we can argue till the cows come home. I think the readers would have access to informations and take their position. Cheers !