Sino Grandness

(13-04-2015, 12:10 PM)specuvestor Wrote: If they managed to pay off the exchangeable bonds in June and July it will be binary positive because it "shows me the money".

If Garden Fresh is also audited by a name such as Foo Kon Tan LLP then it is probably not going to be listed anytime soon.

Looking at NTFS 8, it seems they are audited by FKT.

Mind sharing any reasons why audited by FKT then not gonna list soon?

Not all big fours are good and not all mid tiers are bad.

Moore Stepehens also audit Golden Agri (STI component stock).

The only bad experience I come across with Mid Tier is the auditor for the flopped Trans Cab IPO which I shall not mentioned name but is the obvious choice outside the big 4

"If Garden Fresh is also audited by a name such as Foo Kon Tan LLP then it is probably not going to be listed anytime soon."

How does actually that add up to the success of the upcoming ipo?

I would love a company for keeping its costs down and get the same job done. Rather than going for 'brands'

You have a company that has a generally negative perception of the financials and you get Ah Tiong & Co to audit? Not saying that the big4 are really good in discovering irregularities per se but they at least instill confidence into the numbers for the IPO. Similarly if Goldman is lead manager of the IPO, then it speaks volume, though we can't say Goldman's IPO never flop.

Nether does a more "recognisable" name like Grant Thornton makes it any better
http://www.valuebuddies.com/thread-3371-...l#pid97925

That said now is a good time when China market is hot to IPO. People might not even care so much about short term perception, but the company and lead will still be taking big risk on IPO demand if the perception is not managed well. If they don't grab this window then it is June redemption that we will be looking at.

No prices in guessing why the SHK bonds are extended to June rather than coincide with GS bonds in July. Fat lady have to sing soon and VBs should be able to asset allocate correctly and execute by the catalysts with all the info provided in this thread.

Not all companies with clean unqualified opinion by big 4 doesn't have fraud.

At least FKY better than the auditors for the flopped Trans Cab IPO. Think the depth of under-provision for insurance which leads to the IPO fraud primarily should be worse than actual reported in news. That's what I know upon discussion with a Trans Cab taxi driver.

So Big 5 also means nothing.

(14-04-2015, 11:15 AM)specuvestor Wrote: You have a company that has a generally negative perception of the financials and you get Ah Tiong & Co to audit? Not saying that the big4 are really good in discovering irregularities per se but they at least instill confidence into the numbers for the IPO. Similarly if Goldman is lead manager of the IPO, then it speaks volume, though we can't say Goldman's IPO never flop.

Nether does a more "recognisable" name like Grant Thornton makes it any better
http://www.valuebuddies.com/thread-3371-...l#pid97925

That said now is a good time when China market is hot to IPO. People might not even care so much about short term perception, but the company and lead will still be taking big risk on IPO demand if the perception is not managed well. If they don't grab this window then it is June redemption that we will be looking at.

No prices in guessing why the SHK bonds are extended to June rather than coincide with GS bonds in July. Fat lady have to sing soon and VBs should be able to asset allocate correctly and execute by the catalysts with all the info provided in this thread.

Hi Specuvestor

Oldman believes that Goldman Sachs and Mr Huang are aware of the negative perception. If Goldman Sachs is the sponsor then you can be sure that they will appoint a reputable reporting accountant and if they are not, they would have advised Mr Huang. Consider this one of the perks of having them on Garden Fresh board.

Kind regards
Oldman9

(14-04-2015, 11:15 AM)specuvestor Wrote: You have a company that has a generally negative perception of the financials and you get Ah Tiong & Co to audit? Not saying that the big4 are really good in discovering irregularities per se but they at least instill confidence into the numbers for the IPO. Similarly if Goldman is lead manager of the IPO, then it speaks volume, though we can't say Goldman's IPO never flop.

Nether does a more "recognisable" name like Grant Thornton makes it any better
http://www.valuebuddies.com/thread-3371-...l#pid97925

That said now is a good time when China market is hot to IPO. People might not even care so much about short term perception, but the company and lead will still be taking big risk on IPO demand if the perception is not managed well. If they don't grab this window then it is June redemption that we will be looking at.

No prices in guessing why the SHK bonds are extended to June rather than coincide with GS bonds in July. Fat lady have to sing soon and VBs should be able to asset allocate correctly and execute by the catalysts with all the info provided in this thread.

Hi Specuvestor

I am still under moderation so cannot edit my earlier post.

I do agree with you that the time to list in Hong Kong is now. The company should seize this moment when Hong Kong market is red hot. The question is, are they ready? or will they only submit in June or later? Only Huang knows.

added : http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2...ck-targets

Hang Seng to Rise 14% to 32,000 by June


regards

Oldman9

In pg 9 of Thoresen Thai Agencies annual report http://tta.listedcompany.com/misc/ar/201...-en-01.pdf,
CEO mentions the possibility of Garden Fresh expanding beyond China:
 

Q8: Why did you acquire Sino Grandness? Does TTA Group intend to expand into the F&B business?

It has always been our aspiration to enter the food & beverage business given its high growth potential and
strong earning visibility. So when the opportunity to acquire a fast growing food and beverage company, Sino
Grandness Food Industry Group Limited (“Sino Grandness”), emerged, we decided to act and acquire a 9%
stake in the company. We are excited not only by the exposure to the huge Chinese consumer market, we also
like the dominant market position held by its beverage subsidiary Garden Fresh in the fast growing, and largely
untapped, loquat juice segment in China.
Many have recently questioned our commitment to Sino Grandness, and to which I have answered with our firm
belief in the company. We believe Garden Fresh has an opportunity to tap into international markets, and we will
be supportive of its expansion outside China. In fact, with similar taste-buds among Southeast Asian consumers, we
see potential for Garden Fresh to market its loquat juice product across the region. Thailand will be good market to
start.
Sino Grandness is the start of many more F&B acquisitions to come for TTA Group and we believe it represents a good
start. We have what it takes to build a reputable F&B business in Thailand - this will a key space to watch.

maybe i have read too many "S" chip frauds case, personally i will not touch this counter. not much dividend, free cashflow is low, so much debt, so much problem, financial data may show it is undervalue, but i dont consider undervalue, to me, to be undervalue there must be some certainty to to those financial data, example like they are paying 50% of the income to shareholder, and then the stock price is low, else what is the point wasting so much energy analyzing it, when they are so many "gem" stock with good financial data to analyze

That say, it does not mean it isnt good to follow the company news, just feel, investing at the present state, doesnt seem safe.

(15-04-2015, 07:42 AM)Young Investor Wrote: In pg 9 of Thoresen Thai Agencies annual report http://tta.listedcompany.com/misc/ar/201...-en-01.pdf,
CEO mentions the possibility of Garden Fresh expanding beyond China:
 

Q8: Why did you acquire Sino Grandness? Does TTA Group intend to expand into the F&B business?

It has always been our aspiration to enter the food & beverage business given its high growth potential and
strong earning visibility. So when the opportunity to acquire a fast growing food and beverage company, Sino
Grandness Food Industry Group Limited (“Sino Grandness”), emerged, we decided to act and acquire a 9%
stake in the company. We are excited not only by the exposure to the huge Chinese consumer market, we also
like the dominant market position held by its beverage subsidiary Garden Fresh in the fast growing, and largely
untapped, loquat juice segment in China.
Many have recently questioned our commitment to Sino Grandness, and to which I have answered with our firm
belief in the company. We believe Garden Fresh has an opportunity to tap into international markets, and we will
be supportive of its expansion outside China. In fact, with similar taste-buds among Southeast Asian consumers, we
see potential for Garden Fresh to market its loquat juice product across the region. Thailand will be good market to
start.
Sino Grandness is the start of many more F&B acquisitions to come for TTA Group and we believe it represents a good
start. We have what it takes to build a reputable F&B business in Thailand - this will a key space to watch.

Talking about getting Garden fresh beyond China, it is interesting to note that in a circular dated 12th Dec 2014, Sino Grandness signed an advisory agreement with PM group for advisory services.

PM group, founded by Prayudh Mahatgisiri established a instant coffee plant in Thailand in joint venture with Nestle under their world famous brand name ~ Nescafé. The JV Quality coffee products Co. Ltd. currently shares the same office address as Nescafé (trading) Thailand co. Ltd.

Will we see loquat juice expand beyond China and SEA?

(15-04-2015, 10:17 AM)leeeta Wrote: Talking about getting Garden fresh beyond China, it is interesting to note that in a circular dated 12th Dec 2014, Sino Grandness signed an advisory agreement with PM group for advisory services.

PM group, founded by Prayudh Mahatgisiri established a instant coffee plant in Thailand in joint venture with Nestle under their world famous brand name ~ Nescafé. The JV Quality coffee products Co. Ltd. currently shares the same office address as Nescafé (trading) Thailand co. Ltd.

Will we see loquat juice expand beyond China and SEA?

Expansion is possible so long there are chinese overseas with same taste.

To become mainstream juice like orange or apple juice is unlikely just due to the nature of the fruit. It has usually 4 poisonous seeds (quite large) which needs to be removed before juicing. Ripe fruit are also easily bruised, so hard to harvest. On top of that, the fruit is rather pulpy like plum/apricot so culinary wise is actually more suitable for making thing like jam/jelly/chutney.

These are all just technical but all these extraction difficulties would likely make it a more expensive juice to produce, unless artificial flavouring is introduced, but that would be counter to the health benefits of the juice.

And the "Pei Pa Koa" we chinese are so used to when we get sore throat/cough is actually produced from the loquat leaves as a component and not fruit.(WIKI : Pei Pa Koa is made up of a blend of herbal ingredients[6] including the fritillary bulb (Fritillariae cirrhosae, 川貝母), loquat leaf (Eriobotrya japonica, 枇鈀葉), ladybell root (Adenophora stricta, 南沙參), Indian bread (Wolfiporia extensa, 茯苓), pomelo peel (Citrus maxima, 化橘紅), chinese bellflower root (Platycodon grandiflorum, 桔梗), pinellia rhizome (Pinellia ternata, 半夏), Schisandra seed (Schisandra chinensis, 五味子), Trichosanthes seed (Trichosanthes cucumerina, 瓜蔞子), coltsfoot flower (Tussilago farfara, 款冬花), thinleaf milkwort root (Polygala tenuifolia, 遠志), bitter apricot kernel (Prunus armeniaca, 苦杏仁), fresh ginger (Zingiber officinale, 生薑), licorice root (Glycyrrhiza uralensis, 甘草),[7] and menthol in a syrup and honey base.)

Would suspect the fruit juice probably is full of antioxidants and vitamins just like other fruits like plums so nothing that special, though consumers being consumers might think that the juice is the same as the medicine.

[Image: 200px-Eriobotrya_japonica3.jpg]
Image from Wiki